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A conversation with Dr Ong Kee Beng
March 22, 2007 Johor Baru

Jeff Ooi (JO): It's been 30-odd years before an authorised biography on Tun Dr Ismail comes about...

Dr Ooi Kee Beng (OKB): Precisely. A good biography will need good sources and materials to build on. If not for Tawfik who decided to give his father's private collection (of notes, letters and files) to ISEAS, this book would not have come out.

JO: Why did Tawfik decide to give them to ISEAS of Singapore, instead of some Malaysian research institutes like ISIS, or academics, or even the newspapers?

OKB: I wrote about the matter recently. It is entirely a decision that only Tawfik has the last call... he is Tun's (Dr Ismail) eldest son, and he lost his father at a young age. Those are his family's treasured belongings. But then again, those materials were ageing and slowly turning into bad shape, so he has been scouting around for a reputable archive which can preserve them, and make the best use of them to benefit the future generations, especially the Malaysians, as Tun had played a very important part in the nation-building stage of the country, which was full of significant events during the 1950s, in the run-up to the Independence, right up to the post-May 13 period, and then (up till) 1973 when Tun died of heart attack.

That could be the same thoughts Tawfik had in mind. Tun's contribution to Malaya, and then Malaysia, was so significant that he didn't want to let it fall into the hands of politicians, or writers who are too politically-inclined. He would rather the biography be written by academics... academics who are politically detached.

Moreover, political developments over the last 20 years had also made it more and more difficult for him to publish them in Malaysia, while there is mounting pressure from his family members who wanted them published and shared with the public.

Now with the biography published, we may expect a revival of public debate about Tun's honesty, integrity and political principle in nation-building in current time.

JO: Were you the first choice as the author?

OKB: Any academic could have been the author. In fact, we discussed it at ISEAS with Tawfik and (ISEAS Director, Ambassador) K Kesavapany. Dr Cheah Boon Kheng (a historian formerly of Universiti Sains Malaysia) was mentioned and he was definitely qualified to do the biography. But the process might be slow as some felt Dr Cheah is old.

Tawfik must have noticed my body language, as he called me up the next day to check if I was interested to be the author, with him as the reference person and and advisor for the project. I told him I would be honoured to do it as I am a fellow at ISEAS coordinating the Malaysia Study Programme.

When we met again with Pany at ISEAS, he pointed at me and said: "You do it." Pany (a former Malaysian and Singapore's High Commissioner to Malaysia) agreed. I was relieved of my duties at ISEAS to concentrate on the biography. It was completed in 15 months or so (in time for the 50th anniversary of Malaysia's independence).

JO: You managed to interview many people for the book?

OKB: Yes, I was lucky to have conducted about 50 interviews... in fact I managed to interview (Tun's former first secretary) Tan Sri Lim Taik Choon to get valuable insights and perspectives on Tun... Tun as a reluctant politician as much as a no-nonsense man who wanted to uphold good governance... Tun's personal experience should provide us valuable perspectives about Malaysia, especially during its forming years, post independence, post-Emergency period, and post May 13.

JO: You started your book by narrating the chaotic day when Tun died as the acting Prime Minister, Tun Razak was overseas, and the senior-most Umno leader Sardon (Jubir) appeared to only mess things up preparing for Tun's funeral. Sardon even defied Tun Razak's orders and the actual funeral process had to be halted for hours for a new burial ground to be ready... we didn't have mobile phones then to check things up real time like now...

OKB: That was intentional... starting the book on that tone. The tense moment of chaos, and anxiety with Tun's sudden demise... it should give us some perspectives on many things and thoughts... don't forget when Tun died, Razak was already confirmed suffering from leukemia though the secret was concealed from the public's knowledge... the country was placed in a precarious situation. It was 1973, the country has barely recovered from May 13... the top two leaders in the country were living on borrowed time (Tun himself was having cancer in the neck besides heart problems that killed him)... and the third in line in Umno, Sardon, was not providing significant leadership... we should reflect on such precarious situations in politics.

JO: And you ended the book rather abruptly on 1973? There were certainly many more insurgences of political drama, like King Ghaz who almost changed Malaysian history had he made it to become Prime Minister?

OKB: Yes, I ended it like a cliff-hanger after Tun's death in 1973. Of course there are many dramatic events after Tun, and even after Razak and Hussein Onn took over. But I wanted to let the book end there, to signify that the story continues in Malaysia, life moves on...

(Interjected) Nuraina A. Samad (ENA): Do you think you will carry on with similar biographies like this...

OKB: It is certainly meaningful to do that, biographies of significant figures in Malaysian history. But we need good sources. Without the private collection of sources that Tawfik gave us, we can't produce biographies of this nature. And I still believe that we need to have academics write them. Politicians will just mess them up... less truthful.

(Interjected) Kak Teh: Will there be a Malay version?

OKB: Oh yes, perhaps in two months' time. It's ready. It should be out in a couple of months.

Kak Teh: Who did the translation?

OKB: Someone from Singapore...

(Interjected) Rocky: Ah... another Singaporean...

OKB: We have passed on the translation to our partner in Malaysia, Gerak Budaya. They are going through it.

(Interjected) Kak Teh: How do you translate "The Reluctant Politician", the title?

OKB: If I'm not wrong, it's "BUKAN KERANA PANGKAT: Tun Dr Ismail dan Masanya".

ENA: Hopefully they use Malaysian Malay... I was born in Singapore, some Singapore Malay may mean differently in Malaysian Malay...

JO: I noticed you and I share the same surname, Ooi. Do you happen to be from Penang, or from the north?

OKB: Ah, I am very much a Penang-lang, from Ayer Itam, and studied in St Xavier's Institution.

JO: Then, let me ask you a very frank and straight question, I hope you don't mind. I agree with you that when you undertake a biography project on a Malaysian figure, you need to be emotionally detached, stay dear to historical facts and do not allow political nuances discolour your perspectives and thoughts.

Are you still a Malaysian? And how emotionally detached from Malaysia have you been when you wrote the biography?

OKB: Except for my passport, I am still very much every inch a Malaysian. I grew up a Malaysian, and after my return to Singapore (from Sweden), I became a fellow at ISEAS, focussing on Malaysian affairs. I have not lost touch at all with Malaysia, Malaysians and the changes they have gone through over the last three decades... upheavals, prosperity, I still have a strong sense of all these.

But being academics, we are politically-neutral and I had good sources and materials that Tawfik gave us to build Tun's biography. If you read the chapters, you will notice I have been emotionally detached from the goings-on during Tun's era, though I was a product passing through that period of time.

JO: I was amazed at the way you narrated how awfully much Tun has disliked Tuanku Jaafar ibni Tuanku Abdul Rahman, his first secretary at Washington Embassy when Tun was the ambassador to the US and permanent representative to the UN... bearing in mind that Tuanku Jaafar was the son of the second Agong, and when the prince applied for a transfer to London, it was like 'good riddance bad rubbish' for Tun. Your comment?

OKB: That was kind of sensitive, you know, what do you expect of a young prince hanging around there to behave and to fit into Tun's stern mannerism and high expectations? But those are Tun's private notes, and we have to stay true to his recordings of events. I had tried to portray Tuanku Jaafar in good light. (JO: To balance up?) Yes, to balance up.

JO: But it was equally amazing to note that, Tun Ismail and Ismail Ali (Dr Mahathir's brother-in-law who later became Malaysia's first home-bred governor of the central bank) could get along well in the same office in the foreign land. The two Ismails, both were equally short (in height), both were equally known tough-nuts... both were later Tun Ismails...

OKB: That's what we got to know from the notes. I reckon it must been mutual respect that each had for the other. They were professionally competent, no nonsense and eager to get the job done.

JO: There is an eerie parallel between Tun and Abdullah Badawi. Both of them used golf in dealing with Lee Kuan Yew. (In Page 135), you said Tun believed that golf revealed the person's character, and Tun's analysis of Lee was that the Singapore paramount leader was "very deliberate, and calculates every move he wants to make".

Lee would also make other golfers wait for him, and would take more time than others to study the greens and pacing the distance between the ball and the hole. Also, "Lee doesn't mind losing to a better player, but he always fights to the last". Wonder if that's how Lee out-foxed present Malaysian leaders when dealing on bilateral issues on the golf course?

OKB: Lee Kuan Yew had high respect for Tun, and Tun was the elder between the two. Tun also had a lot of respect for Kuan Yew in return, and began to like him after meeting several times.

JO: Tun was vehemently anti-communist and anti-communism. When the Tunku tried to recognise the People's Republic of China (then referred to as 'Communist China'), Tun threatened to resign from the Cabinet. But in chapters 4 and 5, you narrated that Tun later realised it wasn't communism that would ruin Malaysia, but rather unchecked communalism and race-based politics that will set back the country from moving forward. Your comment?

OKB: It draws a pertinent context to the current situation in Malaysia. I think the readers should be able to get some perspectives about these issues with new insights. They should ask if the country still has the capacity to come up with new ideas to solve old problems (that had been postponed for far too long).

JO: I remembered vernacular newspapers, in the 1970s, were not forgiving towards Tun. Point in case is one occasion after May 13, at a time MCA was in a limbo as the Chinese community had abandoned it during the 1969 general elections, Tun equated MCA as being 'mati tak mau, hidup segan'. Do you see Tun as a Malay ultra, just like young upstarts like Dr Mahathir and Musa Hitam, who trailed after Tun in the later years?

OKB: Oh, the vernacular press thought so? I didn't realise that.

JO: There was, however, another context where you portrayed Tun, and Tun Razak, as being all-encompassing leaders who cared not only for the Malays, but for all Malaysians across the race barriers. Yes, I am talking about the treatment of Tun's funeral.

OKB: You caught that one. (On page 11) I mentioned that Razak was furious over the fact that he wanted Tun's body to lay in state at the Parliament Building so that Malaysians of all faiths could view it without discomfort. It was to be Malaysia's first state funeral after all. But Sardon messed it up by placing Tun's body at the National Mosque. This was obviously against the wishes of Tun Razak, who wanted it to be (a moment of sorrow) shared by all Malaysians (despite the fact that the Sultan of Johor had wanted Tun to be buried in the home state). That's why Razak was furious.

JO: That's also why Razak shouted "I am still the Prime Minister?" before he could rush back from Canada?

OKB: That's how chaotic it was, and how important it is to have strong leadership during hard times.

In small talks later, someone among the five of us mentioned about Tan Siok Choo, the grand-daughter of MCA co-founder Tun Tan Cheng Lock, who accused Ooi of appearing "confused about the founder of the MCA" (see theSun, March 15, 2007).

On Page 65 of the biography, Ooi writes:

"... an Alliance delegation consisting of the Tunku, Ismail, H.S. Lee and Leong Yew Koh - the latter two were founders of the MCA - handed over a resolution to Templer."

To which, Tan snorted that:

His omission of my grandfather, the late Tun Tan Cheng Lock, as the founder of the MCA, is surprising.

Although my grandfather was not a member of the Alliance delegation, Ooi could have re-phrased the parenthesis in the following manner - "the latter two were among several Malayan Chinese who provided the organising energy that helped MCA founder, Tan Cheng Lock, to get the political party off the ground."

The omission of Cheng Lock's pivotal role in the MCA's formation is inconsistent with historical fact. [...]

Furthermore, in Page 125 of the book, The Reluctant Politician, Ooi describes Cheng Lock as the "party founder".

Despite this reference, the omission of Cheng Lock's name on Page 65 gives the reader the misleading impression that only two men - Tun H.S. Lee and Tun Leong Yew Koh - were responsible for the founding of the MCA.

Umno politician Shahrir Abdul Samad also confronted Ooi at the luncheon yesterday, and demanded a clarification from him. Shahrir said: "If it's wrong, say it. After all, it's only one paragraph. Or a correction in the next edition?"

I sensed the outbursts had well reaffirmed why Tawfik had placed greater confidence in academics, not politicians or politically-inclined writers, to bring out his late father's biography.

In my presence, Ooi told Shahrir coolly: "We will make a statement when the time comes."