Screenshots

"Pak Lah called for bridge-builders to come forefront, where "the people of the West will speak for Islam and the Muslims will speak for the West"."

I am sure there are many. But whether their voices will be heard is the question. The anwer to that is, would their voices and deeds sell newspapers and bring in advertising revenue?

If you, like me, answered no, then you can see, really what is needed is a complete revamp of the media industry who many a time provide the platform as well as the reason for insanity to prevail!

Just imagine, if there was no Al Jazeera to air al Qaeda's messages, they will have no messages to air. And messages to be valid have to be backed by substantive actions. Substantive actions whose message need to be carried become meaningless if there are no couriers to deliver that message. The entire chain is what provides teh impetus for a lot of teh meaningless violence today.

The Malaysian protests was not so much for the venting of frustration or anger. It was just a package to be delivered as there were couriers only too willing to deliver the message!

To borrow/modify a Vulcan saying:
"The actions of the few mirror the many, or the all"
This is an unfortunate reality we live in today.

I for one, don't support the PAS-led protest, but I respect that their voice be heard. And as seen by their actions (and those of their supporters), the real agenda becomes apparent.

The media plays a huge role in shaping public opinion on any issue, and I also maintain a strong view that every media entity has its own bias.

I am of the opinion that PAS, in organizing this protest march, tries to portray itself as a champion of the entire Malay/Muslim ummah - isn't that an UMNO banner (yellow on red), just next to the one that says "We Love Our Prophet"?

That, to me is their agenda, and unfortunately, many of the Malays will undoubtedly see this rally/protest as "proof" of their "noble motivations".

In reporting events like these, it is important, therefore, that the media don't take sides, and present the facts, not conjecture. So, far, this has been the case in the mainstream Malaysian media, and for that I am thankful.

Conjecture leads to misunderstanding, which then leads to furor - which, once uncontained, sometimes results in actions that are regrettable, but never retractable.

To their credit, the PAS-led protest kept their word and their cool. Islam DOES NOT condone senseless violence, and the last thing the world-view needs is another stupid display by the few, tarnishing the reputation of the many, or of the all.

Does anyone know if the protestors had a police permit to gather in such large numbers?

I support media like Al Jazeera that gives us the other side of the story. Otherwise, we are brainwashed into idiots.

Likewise I support blogs like Screenshots that give us a different side of the story. Sometimes, even giving us a story when no one else tells it.

There are times I disagree with Jeff’s views or the way he presents it, but I give him due respect. If we ever meet face to face, and get into an argument, I don’t believe we will come to blows or commit any act of violence.

Currently, there are members of my family and many friends who work overseas, and they are required to travel extensively. We worry about their safety and hope they will not become victims of the senseless violence sparked off by brainless people and fanned by robotic people.

"Just imagine, if there was no Al Jazeera to air al Qaeda's messages, they will have no messages to air."

That's a joke. Any news agency is obliged to report the news if the message is dropped off anoymously off with the BBC etc. they would still have to report it. The peaceful Malaysian protests was a political process, part and parcel of any democracy. Whether or not the majority of the population condones or agrees with the protestors' cause and actions is another matter altogether.

Would voters be turned on by the "Long live Islam. Destroy Denmark. Destroy Israel. Destroy George Bush. Destroy America," some of the protesters shouted." message?

In another press anomaly, Bernama reported there were 12000 protestors while CNN reported only 3000 protestors? Which of these two is the correct figure?

This entire fiasco is saddening as Danish people is probably one of the nicest and peace-loving people I've came to know.

But their media should've been more sensitive and respectful towards other religions. Free speech is just like any other free rights - you can do it but that doesnt mean you should.

I am curious....There are 12+ cartoons that were deemed offensive by some quarters. Have the protestors seen the cartoons for themselves and judged them offensive or are they just following orders?

Apparently, the crowd chanted fiery slogans such as ‘Hancur Denmark’ (Destroy Denmark) and ‘Mati Denmark’ (Death to Denmark). ARe thi snit serious threats? Can the Danish Embassy lodge police reports. ANd if they did will they police investigate?

I know it sounds petty , but i still trying to rationalise these recent activities. SOme of you will know what i am geeting at. Those who don't will rebuke me.

"Most people would rather die than think; in fact, they do so."-Bertrand Russell

Typos:
Apparently, the crowd chanted fiery slogans such as ‘Hancur Denmark’ (Destroy Denmark) and ‘Mati Denmark’ (Death to Denmark). ARe this not serious threats? Can the Danish Embassy lodge police reports? ANd if they did will they police investigate?

I know it sounds petty , but i am still trying to rationalise these recent activities.

Some of you will know what i am getting at. Those who don't will rebuke me.

"Most people would rather die than think; in fact, they do so."-Bertrand Russell

what the hell the iranians got to do in Malaysia and in this protest.I just don't get it, why are they idolising Khomeini?Is he PAS's idol? Guess Iran moves PAS people and that is their role model.

"Does anyone know if the protestors had a police permit to gather in such large numbers?"
dr Stranggeove -- are you kidding? -- For some privileged people, a crowd like 8,000-10,000 is a celebration.
Butt for DAP members -- or commoners like you and me -- any group larger than 4 (see?) evn at a mamak stall can get thee thrown into jail for up to 7 days with no need or cause to xplain...

Do you still remeber the UMNO Youth marchoing on the Chinese Assembly Hall building some time back threatening to burn down Suqui's office?

Oh, Malaysians have short -- o isit selective -- memory recall...
I weep for..
OR ist For whom the bell tolls ...?

Dear Jeff, you wrote:

What was unsettling was that some were even seen carrying photographs of the late Iranian Islamic revolutionary icon and the late president, Ayatollah Khomeini.

FYI these small group of people, 10-15 of them are Shiite followers, nothing to do with the big group. They were taking advantage of the large crowd.

Freedom of expression - what to do.

>Butt for DAP members -- or commoners like you and me -- any group larger than 4 (see?) evn at a mamak stall can get thee thrown into jail for up to 7 days with no need or cause to xplain...

>Do you still remeber the UMNO Youth marchoing on the Chinese Assembly Hall building some time back threatening to burn down Suqui's office?

It shows that Malaysia has double standards. Malaysia boleh. Apa macam pun boleh.

One doesn't see how chanting kill and destroy can count as befitting any prophet's believers, let alone He of Islam.

Knowing how brittle the folks are, everything should have been done before the protest to search for inner wisdom, not open the floodgates of emotion.

For isn't any religion first and foremost about quelling the irrational within man in his journey towards the Almighty?

How does calling for the destruction of another country due to the act of one cartoonist serve His higher calling?

Wouldn't the wrath within that had provoked such emotions denude all of His Sacrifices until they fall below those of, say, a mortal, take a pick - a gandhi perhaps?

12,000? If anyone had missed the posters, s/he would have been forgiven to think the crowd actually had come out to protest about a Manchester United loss.

Until we wake up that another malaysian who was an afghan veteran has actually been identified to fly the LA suicide plane.

And what was going on in his mind when he pulled out because he saw the casualty of the first wave? 5,000 was too many? would 10 be enough to convey a message? wouldn't 1 suffice? how about 0 instead?

From bomb-making in Indonesia to boeing kamikaze, how can this country, chairing the OIC, ever even dignify its chair to 'make bridges' and turn swords to plowshare of goodwill, if the government doesn't make a stand that once you skew the scale of justice thinking a particular group should forever be mollycoddled with kids-gloves, you do them a grievous disservice instead - they stop evolving into higher order men that will ease their journey to the Almighty.

How can what has happened these past few days - from operation lallang revisited to k&d protests captured in technicolour around the word - show this country is a progressive state, let alone a shining example of how to practise moderation?

I had wanted to post this quote from the novel Zahir by Paulo Coelho, that now sits pretty in a number of bookshops locally, but held back because one had dreamed of a better world. It seems that hope was sorely misplaced, so what-the-heck:

"According to the writer Jorg Luis Borges, the idea of the Zahir comes from Islamic tradition and is thought to have arisen at some point in time in the eighteenth century. Zahir, in Arabic, means visible, present, incapable of being unnoticed. It is someone or something which, once we have come into contact with them or it, gradually occupies our every thought, until we can think of nothing else.

This can be considered either a state of holiness, or of madness.

Fauberg St-Peres
Encyclopedia of the Fantastic (1953)"

Did anyone see the live programme aired on CNN...a CNN satire that came with disclaimers of course? Of course it made fun of the the protests and the cartoons. But more importantly it also carried a mock up that resembled or at least attempted to resemble The Buddha with a bomb on the stomach. I am surprised this CNN programme, which is censored in Malaysia, was allowed to be aired, especially in the present climate. Anyway, I did not take offence.

observer,

it wasn't a "buddha with a bomb on the stomach", it was a buddha in the shape of a bong, as in the apparatus used to smoke pot.

more accurately, it was a bong in the shape of a buddha :P

Well said, Neil.

Desirata...you expressed my point 100%

Curious. So, moderate Muslims are being asked to turn their other cheeks while what they believe in, and profess, is being insulted?

And, no matter how grievous the slur, just grin and bear it, because that's the price of living in a multi-cultural, multi-religious, multi-racial world?

Seems to me that a lot is being asked of the moderate Muslims. It's as if they are being condescended to by the intellectual elite who believe that the freedom of the press is sacrosanct.

At what point do people decide that the price of integration and "fitting in" is just too much?

These are serious points, because it's only a short step from the freedom to caricature a religion to caricaturing a culture, society and norms. And where do you draw the line in a descent down the slippery slope of intolerance and bigotry?

Observer, in my earlier postings i had said, other religions get insulted and ridiculed everyday, but you don't see anyone going aroung torching buildings and boycotting goods.

I felt sick when i watched the Last Temptation of Christ. What did i do? I stopped watching it mid way and returned the rented DVD.

I neither demanded for Scorcese's head nor boycotted US goods. In fact i still watch Scorcese's movies.

What makes 'their' religion / sentiments so special? WHy is every one afraid of that religion? The UK and Aust are bending backwards to please them. WHat the hell for? The UK and Aust had their Xmas celebration on a moderate scale last year as to respect people who practise 'that' religion. What the hell for? I cannot quote my sources exactly but if i am not mistaken it was mentioned in The Australian.

ACtually, if one looks at the some of the cartoons rather inteligently, one would notice that the cartoons hit a raw nerve as they were somewhat true. They were not mocking the true ISlam but rather mocking the distorted interpretation of Islam.

How amny of you here have indeed seen all the 12 or so cartoons?

Jeff, please censor my posting as you deem right.

My message to hypocritical religious zealots:The world is one big satire. Get a life and get on living.

Calling for the death of the Danish? I thought religion is suppose to preserve the sanctity of life.

Just because a person is a son of a criminal, we should brand him as such. And just because a person is a son of a great person, we should not give him such credit until he has proven himself.

The cartoons are branding Muslims. We should not brand Danes by saying death to Danes just because a few Danes have done something disrespectful. Does this make us better in principle?

The non-Muslim West is judging Muslims by western standards. And if we judge the non-Muslim West by Muslim standards, we are in principle, doing the same thing. The cycle doesn’t stop. It is up to us to pro-actively stop it, and not being reactive.

I would respect their right to march and protest, even to the extent of causing disturbance. The great Mahatma did it, and he was THE model of peace. He would've smiled to see 3 000/10 000/12 000 people on one of his marches. But to chant slogans like "Hancur Denmark", "Mati Denmark" and by holding up posters of Khomeini (which has absolutely nothing to do with the issue) is just showing how stupid, and how easily led they are. It just gives the impression that although we profess to be a moderate tolerant society, we are at heart still pissed off at the great West for the myriad of wrongs we perceive them to have done against us and our people. It doesn't take a huge step to go from chanting "Mati Denmark" to "Mati Amerika" to "Jom bom Amerika" to "OK!". So yes, freedom of speech which I support, but slogans like those are best left to extremists in Afghanistan, and sadly here in London. Malaysia does NOT want to be tarred with the brush of terrorism.

The Chinese have a saying. It's " Nothing better to do after eating".

I would think this is more a case of nothing better to do after praying. Sure there maybe a percentage that really believe in thier cause, but i'll bet most of them are there to 'Kaypo'.

Pak Lah is right. “Build bridges we must, fight we must not” – Yoda said too. I remembered when the West (USA to be precise) and Mujaheedeen were together fighting the Russians. Even Rambo contributed as a ‘brother’ to the Muslim fighters! I remembered from reading Chinese war literature where there was a period of seven kingdoms where when one kingdom gotten too strong, the others will gang together to moderate the powerful one. In European history, I read the same happened. Now I read Pak Lah mentioned the word ‘hegemony’ in his speech. I agree with him that when one has become the sole superpower then peace (on earth) may be more alluding. The strongest nation on this earth went from fighting mother (of communist) Russia, to red China and now to green Islam in the past 50 years.

With the rising of China and India, together with a moderate and progressive Islam, history has shown us a potentially better earth to live, together with the West. I think this will happen in 10-20 years time. In the meantime, hang-on to your peace loving nature and have faith in the loving God. There are Christians in Iraq and Muslims in Denmark so how could each proclaim they represent God and kill off their own brethren. Open your eyes and heart! (Unless you say that you can’t find 5 person of your faith in each country).

I have come across historians as generally peace-loving people as they LEARNED from the PAST to PRESERVE the FUTURE. Let us learn to live together, Muslims and non-Muslims, whites and non-whites, Bumis and Sepets ….. else I regretted not joining the contest to be the first Malaysian astronaut ….. to migrate potentially to Mars!

P.S. Jeff, there’s always hope.

What do the Christian community do when there is a movie that mocks the Christian faith ?

Read on!
http://www.christianexaminer.com/Articles/Articles%20Jun04/Art_Jun04_01.html

In any street demonstration, protesters write all kinds of things on their placards. So expect it!

In Malaysia, people like PAS will lead this kind of demonstration. So expect it!

PAS must show its strength by getting the numbers, by hook or by crook. So expect it!

If we carelessly or insensitively make insulting comments or insinuations in this blog, we can help PAS get more people to join the demonstrations. So expect it!

"Destroy Denmark. Destroy Israel. Destroy George Bush. Destroy America"

Yeah...could be possible for that single person mentioned there. But to destroy a country?

Really hypocrites! Have they even wondered that the toy (Lego) that their children might be playing with, the no-brainer reality TV programmes they watch on TV, and the insulin (Novo) they are injecting to control their diabetes (which is ironically their most-populated state is the No.1 for diabetes) are from the countries that they want to destroy?

If they have got the enlightening, perhaps they should stop those SMSes for the latest Akademi Fantasia forever as the concept is also from a Western Country that they want to destroy.

Really hypocrites!!!

Tit for tat. The Christian rights have a field day using these" torching of embassies", "violent demonstrations" as case studies to raaly the Anglo-Saxons brothers and sisters across the globe. Here is but one comment :

A 'Monstrous Overreaction'
Robert Spencer, director of the group Jihad Watch describes the Islamic furor over the cartoons as "a massive, monstrous, global overreaction."

"In the first place," says Spencer, "there's nothing offensive at all about most of the cartoons. A couple of them take note of the connection between Islam and terrorism, which no doubt [Muslims] find offensive." But for those in the Western world to notice it and for cartoonists to lampoon it is "pretty tame," he says, "compared to what political cartoonists do routinely to Western political figures."

But according to Spencer, that does not matter to the Muslims who are responding violently and fanatically. "The content of the cartoons is not really the problem at all," he shares. "Just the fact of the cartoons -- because Islamic law forbids representation of the prophet in any form, it's simply an insult to picture him. Even if the pictures were respectful, [many Muslims] would still be upset."

Spencer believes it is a good thing that Europe is finally waking up to the Islamic threat in its midst. "There is a reaction building in Europe, and that is something that's altogether positive actually," he says. "And the fact that so many places have published these things is very positive because it indicates that people are waking up to the fact in Europe that free speech [and] other liberties are threatened."

http://headlines.agapepress.org/archive/2/62006f.asp

I see anti-Jew and anti-Christian cartoons all the time but I don't see them all jump up screaming in anger. They go away like all other politically oriented cartoons.

What is creating such a ruckus with regard to these "Muslim" cartoons is that some Muslims are taking such a violent negative reaction to them.
Consequently, again, it's not really the cartoons making the news but the irrational and violent reactions to the cartoons.

But , I am confused. Islamic law forbids representation of the prophet in any form, it's simply an insult to picture Him. Even if the pictures were respectful, many Muslims would still be upset.

But, I came across lots Medieval Muslim artists often created paintings and illuminated manuscripts depicting Mohammed in full in history books such as these here :-

http://www.zombietime.com/mohammed_image_archive/islamic_mo_full/

Can someone enlighten us?

with that much of protesters, how come no FRU were present to control the situation, and iido not think they have a permit to have such a gathering, how come ar?

apa hal?

it does looks very much like a "riot"

and what has the iranian icon has to do with this?

The frustrations and the anger of the muslim community is understandable. However, from 100 ppl gathering last friday to over 10,000 ppl in the following week, there is indeed a cause for alarm here. How certain are we that after next week friday's prayers, we would not be witnessing another protest which might turn into violence?

I have seen the caricatures posted in several websites which is rather mild and with the exception of several, most of it I do not find ot offensive in any way. There many other websites that make a mockery of the Islamic Faith which is far more offensive and degrading. Hence, should PAS be demonstrating every other day in front of practically every foreign embassy in Malaysia?

Several questions remain unanswered here. First and foremost, have the protestors really seen those caricatures in person? I guess there are just jumping into the bandwagon on the wave these protests going on worldwide. PAS on the other hand, is trying to exploit this issue for its political mileage.

Secondly, was a permit issued for these peaceful protest cum gathering outside Wisma Denmark yesterday? I doubt such permit was ever issued. To my knowledge, despite the constitution provided for freedom of expression, there has never been police permit issued to opposition political parties to hold assemblies.

This whole issue has been emotionally led. Worst still, innocent Danish people and the West has been targetted as such. It is indeed ridiculous to find similar protest outside US consulate in Surabaya, Indonesia whereby burning of US flag and effigies took place. Is US to be blamed again? These protestors are real morons to do so and I guess they were just looking for scapegoats to vent their anger.

At moments like these, I am on the opinion that the govt. should invoke the provisions provided in ISA to detain Hadi Awang and those PAS lieutenants before the whole situation gets out of hand.

have we decided to join the bandwagon of [ DELETED ]? Is this the 3rd world mentality in us creeping out?

Our is this just an incident of the blind leading the blind; the dumb leading the dumber?

Seriously, when i saw the pictures all i could do was shake my head... i was filled with shame. Ashamed of my countrymen.

Could it get any lower than this?

"Morons", "idiots", all very apt words. How about sheep? They follow blindlessly, they baa when they're told to and they're a bit blur.

Thomas,
Much as I'd love for these people to be taught a lesson in manners, the ISA should never be used to curb free speech. But it makes a lovely thought, doesn't it? Imagine all of them being slammed in the nick, heads shaven, sleep deprivation. Sigh...

Just heard the news on bbc online, about the demonstrations in London. 4 000 people took part, chanting peaceful slogans, expressing displeasure at the cartoons, but also condemning the violence of extremists in the Arab countries. They only used placards approved by the stewards. This is how a protest should be, peaceful and focused on the issue. Hopefully more news forthcoming.

These protests make Malaysia look bad.

How would people know if it is led by Pas party?

This is an islamic country for goodness sake.

This is going to be bad for the tourism industry. :-P